What are some success stories from people who have ended their relationship with a narcissist?

Answer 1

MBME So glad to hear from you. Don't feel embarrassed. I don't know how strong I would be if he came crawling back. But you needed to do this to finally get it! Just don't let him hurt you anymore. Think....has he ever in all his drama and crying and pleading...had he ever cried real tears for what he did to you? Has he ever really looked at you and said, "Oh, my God, I am so sorry...what did I do to you...how are you dealing?" Or is it always, what he needs, how he is suffering? I just started reading a great book: Women Who Love Too Much. I know, awful title, but it really describes me and how I always pick me I care take care of, who never reciprocate. And it explains why, which really demystifies these jerks. Look for it on Amazon. And write back. I am praying for you. By the way, I am really keeping my eyes open with this new guy. Really slow and looking for flags. Take care, CB

Hello Everyone...I have made the huge mistake of returning to my N, and already I am more miserable than before. Only this time I can see clearly, and I am actually falling out of love with him. I have talked with the woman he dumped me for. I receive daily calls from his ex, words of love and support. I am still trying to get him to see the way he is and I have to DO IT ALL AGAIN, get over it and leave him...for good. He will be abandoned, no not for long, for he will find someone else. But it breaks my heart. I really can't write much tonite but thank you CareBear, for caring about me. For everyone reading this particular FAQ...you can never go back unless you want to ruin yourself. All these posters are telling you from the heart. I thought I was through, but obviously I have more pain to go through...and therapy starts next week, thank God. Peace and Love to all, and I am doing ok. This is a horrible way to live. YAY CareBear, so happy for you....! I will write when all this is done, what a drama I will have to relate. Too narcissistic for me, I get embarassed just reiterating all the ridiculousness! mbme

MBME, I am worried about you!!! I just met a nice, normal man and you will too if you let go of the past. Let me know how you are! CAREBEAR

CB HERE< MBME< Therapy will help you. It helps me to think that all the good traits you think he has, you gave to him. They camr from him reading your dreams, but they are not real, just an illusion. You know if your gut, no matter how much you think you love him, that something is terribly wrong. Trust your gut. ANd please try to get out.

MBME here. Thank you for replying, CB. That is really a good analogy...this is the first addiction I have ever had. I can't think of any other way to explain it, you are right. And the only way to quit an addiction is to stop.

But I did set up a therapy appointment for him (I had to do it, to me it was a cry for help)...if he ever calls again, I am giving him the appontment date and time and telling him it's his responsibility, not mine and leaving it at that. I am so tired of this. If he doesn't call again, oh well, just better for me. His ex texted me today, she sounds upset and I hope the children are ok after their weekend with him. I really need to distance myself from his influence...but I care very much for his kids. I truly believe that if he doesn't get help, there will be some kind of a circumstance or bad occurrence soon. I am doing fine, anxious to start therapy and get this drama behind me. He is certainly a desperate man...he sounds like he is coming unglued. Well, I will let everyone know what is going on in a later post, but in the meantime, I am getting on with the business of life. One step at a time, and getting stronger everyday I don't see or talk with him.

It is amazing how much we all have put up with. Then, all of a sudden, there is this flash of light, an awakening...and you see just how ridiculous the narcissist really is. A pathetic person, really...a shell and a non-entity - forever tossed to and fro trying to find someone to help him fill the void inside of himself. I can't imagine not having a mind of my own, thank God I got out of this relationship and I still have a mind - albeit a wounded one but it still is mine and mine alone! Peace to all...mbme

AnswerHEY MBME, Carebear here. Thanks for the support. I think it is best to think of these people like drugs that are very bad for you. You crave them, but they will never give you healthy satisfaction. They cannot give you what you need, no matter how badly you want it. You can explain to them what they should want and need, and how you could offer them a healthy life, but they cannot bond with anyone; therefore, it doesn't appeal to them. Please try not to call him or see him, MBME! No judgment if you do. I don't know how strong I could be, but no contact is the key. Remember he is like an addiction and you will never change the dynamic. He will always be a user and a selfish, cold person. You are wasting time in your life you cannot get back and giving it to him. He does not deserve you. Here's what I do sometimes. I imagine the man who does deserve me, waiting for me. He is the one I should worry about. He is out there and needs me and will love and I am wasting our life together by spending time on this narcissist. Please don't let him hurt you again. If my ex-boyfriend had loved me, he would never have left me. He would still be here. He wouldn't be sleeping with someone else. He is ultimately just in love with himself. It was never about me. I exhausted myself trying to make him happy, and I just never could. God Bless.

MBME: Hi Everyone. CareBear - you are grieving. I had a bad marriage too, and even the end of that marriage never hurt as much as the ending of this relationship. I have to share with you...I talked with him. I picked up the phone in the middle of the night thinking it was one of my kids. Almost got reeled back in. He wants to get back together, he asked me to get him some therapy and if I would go. He is surely a somatic narcissist, told me all the right things, told me he wanted to get married, denied the 2 week relationship with another woman, downright lied even when I told him everything I had been told by my true friends. It was so pathological.

I know, I know, why do we love them? I know it hurts...not one man in this world did I love more than him, and still do. It's not you who failed, it was HIM. Loneliness hurts, and yes, I want to believe that there will be a true love for us. We are good people. Why would God not want us to have good men? Surely he knows how we are grieving.

Perhaps we have to learn more about ourselves. It sure sounds as if you have done a lot of soul-searching through the years, just like me. I am tired of being alone too. I am worthy of a good love. I am not the type to go out and get laid for the sake of it. (Sorry so vulgar there). I have to feel something for a man - something good. It hurts so much, I know.

He wants to get together this week. Why can't I get it through my thick skull that I am being used again? Because I want to believe something that isn't true, I guess. I want to believe deep down that he really wants me and sooner or later he will realize. I need to remember that he doesn't say the words I need to hear. He doesn't act the way I need a man to act if he is in love with me. He just wants sex. Period. Really big differences between us. Theonly thing he has going for him is that he thinks he is the ultimate sexual fantasy for every woman he conquers. He wouldn't believe the truth if a woman spit it in his face...he'd always be the best, and it doesn't matter what anyone says. Everyone else is just lying or trying to persecute him because he is so unique.

I met many men last night out at a club, that was fun but what a bunch of desperate people (at bars). I am tired of it after 2 weeks. I think I'll go to the movies, but I can't even watch a love scene on TV without getting mad and disgusted! LOL!

Sounds like you are having a bad day. I feel bad because I answered the phone and I should have left it well enough alone and hung up when I heard his voice. Now he has the last laugh. He knows just what he did. He called to ensure I was still his secondary Narcissistic source. I am.

But I am pulling away, and someday when he heals, he'll look back and think of me as the one who really loved him. By then, I will be a happier person, surrounded by all the people who love me and maybe...the right man WILL FIND ME! Keep up the good work. I am thinking of you and everyone else. Keep me in your prayers because I am very weak and close to a rendezvous with him. I know the way it will be, me leaving with a guilty conscience and a feeling of being used like a warm body and thrown away.

So everyone - don't hate yourselves for feeling the way you do...it is normal, it is right, and be glad that you can FEEL the LOVE, because Narcissists can't. I would rather feel this way than never experiencing love again. Love and Peace mbme

AnswerME CAREBEAR: Hey all. I had a rough day today. I had a dream about him last night and remembered the beginning, when he seemed great and normal, better than normal. Sometimes, I think what is wrong with me? Why does he want this new person and not me? I tried so hard. He could leave me so suddenly and just refocus on someone new with no regret, remorse, etc. I have not had a lot of relationships, but I never had one end this way, not even my bad marriage. This relationship was just suddenly and shockingly over at a point of what I thought was total committment and love. It wasn't perfect, but I was willing to work. I was invested and he was not. That is what makes it wrong, right? Someone, please tell me what do you do when you are doubting yourself, doubting if anyone will love you, wondering if he really is a narcissist? How do you get a hold of yourself again? Thanks all.

13Oct06;;;; Thank you so much for the last post...it's at the bottom of the page, everyone! I am trying to keep all of our posts in some type of order, so if anyone new comes in, they can follow our train of conversation. Please type your answers right at the top of the answer section!

The last post... That is a success story too! A lot of wisdom wrapped up in those paragraphs, so thank you for sharing. I think so much of all of you. Boy, we ARE pretty darn good people, aren't we! I am so sorry for everything you went through, but I think due to our make-up we probably didn't have a choice, we HAD to experience this. We can love deeply and all-encompassing. I am YOU, TOO!

I too suffered from horrible depression throughout this relationship...right up until each time he called and I heard his voice. Then, like magic, it was gone. I was with him. I had everything I wanted, except happiness. Then, the inevitable. We'd fight, he'd dump, I'd go back into my hole, I'd be depressed....until we got back together again. What a nightmare. The events that took place between us were hellish. The vicious world of NPD. Chaos, tears, beatings, infidelities, lies, resentments, depressions, drugs, alcohol, tortured relationships with others, anxieties...the list of atrocities goes on.

Without him, I feel bittersweet remorse. He was everything to me but now I have given him up. For all the right reasons. And I BROKE UP WITH HIM! MY VICTORY! I am feeling better being by myself. I am going to start counseling, I have medication to help me with my depression and mood swings (up and down feelings about my ex N, myself). I have friends and a life and I am beginning to LIKE myself again.

I do miss him terribly, though only for what he was when I first met him...it was really all just a facade. He has stopped calling after only 2 days of trying to reach me, so I guess he has given up on me finally, the coward. He's on to another relationship no doubt, or has dropped into his cycle of depression. I am sure he will come out of it even more deluded than he was before and end up blaming and hating me. Whatever.

HOPE is my main word now. HOPE for a new me. A stronger me. A more positive me. I will never again tolerate the intolerable again. I know what is right and what is wrong for me, and the kind of life and people I want to be around. I can't be with him. It would be living a lie.

Again, my deepest gratitude to all of you, because YOU ALL are keeping me away from a monster. You are enabling me to draw strength into myself, you are enabling me to believe that there IS GOOD in the world...ALL OF YOU! May God bless and please keep sharing! Peace and Love, mbme

ANSWER::::Thank you CareBear, it's good to finally hear from you, I was getting worried about you. I needed to hear everything you said. I am sitting here depressed because for 2 days straight he has tried to contact me and nothing tonite. Luckily I didn't answer the phone either time, but it could have happened this evening. Your post really made my whole day today. You ARE getting strong, we have to remember that it isn't all in our heads...thus the therapy! Can't wait to start. Please let me know how your therapy progresses, it would be a great help. Until then, peace to you, stay strong and to all those in this type of distress - we can help each other. Peace, mbme

THANK YOU ALL : CAREBEAR AGAIN I had a very important appointment with my therapist today. I know this man has left me and moved on, and I am still processing. There is this one moment ( actually several like it) that I keep getting stuck on. It was in May and he looked at me after having too much wine and say so mushy, "I love you so much. I just love you. Please never leave me." It seemed like the one genuine, unguarded moment in the relationship and it kept me hanging on. Maybe he got scared, blah, blah, blah. But my therapist said it translates to "Maybe I can finally get what I want from you..." which is the constant adoration and affirmation he needs. BUT here's the important point: IT WAS NEVER ABOUT ME!!!!!! It was never, "I see you and love you and adore all that is good about you." It was just what he could get from me. AND THAT IS NOT LOVE!!!!! Here's the hard thing. They never really see you as a person. Just a source for them. People who love you NOTICE YOU! These narcissists are blind to everyone but themselves. Even their kids are reflections, not people. I am trying to keep strong. God BLess all of you. Good night!

Answer == Thank you, AlwaysLearning. That's a great success story...and thank you so much for lifting my spirits. My ex N called again this evening, and instead of texting, he left a voicemail. "I don't know why you have to be so childish and not answer your phone. I just wondered if you got the message." His text message last night was "Sorry, I'm an ass$%^&". He has no respect for me whatsoever.

Less than 3 weeks ago, he suddenly up and offs me, the very same night begins a relationship with another woman, and when she decides it's off just two days ago, he begins calling me the next night. How sick is that? How callous and cruel. You would think he would say something like, "I cheated on you. It was a big mistake. I feel horrible, I know I hurt you deeply. Is there anything I can do to make it up to you? Could we meet and talk about it?" No, just his usual, bumbling, unhumble ignorant self...all conversation is me, me, me, I, I, I. Par for the course, right?

Who could ever think of answering the phone call of a person who does the unspeakable (my last posts on this subject matter explains it all but it's nothing we all haven't been through!)He expects absolute forgiveness...it's like he has totally blacked out everything he did! Which could be possible given his mental state. I start therapy the beginning of November, and I truly need it.

I still love him so much. (Do I really after that voicemail? Talk about confirmation of ignorance!) But I still pray that he will heal. But I have no reservations about what he is. I know I cannot talk to him, I too suffered tremendously when I gave in each time I meant to leave. No contact is my only vindication. Each day that passes without my acknowledging him, I have had a victory. It is a thin line though. I am trying to be strong. I am meeting other people, and try to go out each weekend to a club or to a friend's house. I am staying very busy. This is a wonderful site that has helped me immensely.

I hope I can help others...I am moving through this one second at a time. Every time he calls I feel a chink in my armor, then stronger when I haven't answered the phone. I sometimes say that I will never go back to him, unless he was on his hands and knees on glass and apologized to my children before apologizing to me. But who could really know if it was real then, right? Who could really know. Too much risk. I know I couldn't have a relationship built on the atrocious memories between us. With therapy, ...they will all start vanishing piece by piece soon. I plan to share my therapy time with this site.

My prayers to all fellow sufferers...it will end, won't it! Be strong! Hearing his voice exhausted me, and I had a good cry and a talk with God. I'm to bed. Peace and love, mbme +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

These type of people truly have a twisted sense of justice. Last night I received a text message from my ex N..."sorry I'm an ass%^&$". It only figures that the only correct punctuation he used was the apostrophe on the "I'm". Image the gall of these people, blaming us for the results of their behavior, and the flippant way they can just mime words and expect us to receive them like crumbs. No way. When that message came through, I had an anxiety attack. I had to have my son look at the message and tell me what it said. My son was so comforting, holding me tight as I broke down. I mean I totally broke down. My son kept saying, "It's alright Mom, don't you dare call him, he's playing and it doesn't meant anything, I know how you feel. If he was any kind of a man he would be doing something better than text messaging you." What a night. Thank God for my son. I still feel horribly jittery this morning, filled with these delusions and what-if's. Maybe she kicked him to the curb and now he is sorry, (what - after 2 weeks?), maybe he really means it, or maybe someone told him that he needed to make some sort of amends because I was a mess. I certainly hope that last one wasn't why he called. I don't need or want his perverse pity. Still, victory is mine because I did not confirm his presence. I am going to win this war. I am going over the top and out of it without being a casualty. Hope you are doing better, too. Know who your true friends are, and don't worry about your good name. It will stay with you. Focus on YOU and your children and improving your relationship with you, them and God. Keep in touch, Peace to all my friends here, mbme

AnswerDear MBME- Please take heart and know that you did the right thing. I am applauding you for your courage, and that's just what it takes! This sounds like "hoovering" (a term I learned from another personality disorder post.) "Hoover" as in "Vacuum"...He is trying to suck you back in! But THIS time it ain't WORKIN'...Good for you.I hope you are feeling better. AnswerThanks so much for those kind, encouraging words, Grvtattoo. That really made me feel better! He tried to call me again last night. From what I have been told, this woman has left him. I called it so right, but I am not proud or thankful for it, realization of what an automaton he is, how enslaved he is to his mental disorder is a heartbreaker. I am so appalled that he chooses to call me so swiftly, after the horrible thing he did. He has zero, zip, zilch respect for me.

He has no remorse at all, truly, and I can only imagine the depth of his sadness, despair and depression now. (If that is a N capability - and I think not). What a horrible existence. And what could be in his thinking, that I would accept him back after he has had a sexual liaison with someone else? Exposed my beloved (although his) children to his flagrant immorality, (left me like lightning first)...what a path of devastation he has made. Just like a tornado. And he keeps doing it over and over and over. What a nightmare for all.

I want to make it clear that I am not a religious fanatic, feeling that religion is an individual search and should be respected. I would like to share the following. I had been praying to Jehovah to exact vengeance in His time and in His way. Alot of that prayer was my anger and my search for His friendship, love, protection and help through this horrible, tortuous relationship that was killing me.

I know that acted-out violence and evil maneuvers and thoughts toward others is wrong. God knows that I love my ex N, but I love God's ways more than my ex N now. Being somewhat new to the concept of Christianity, to decidedly following Christ AND just now forming a relationship with God, I never thought He would be listening and help me. Now He HAS helped me. Jehovah has made it so clear that He has answered my prayer. Now it is up to me to continue listening to Him, and to follow His Word and commandments. Which means I must not look back. Which means my ex N has the chance to change...WITHOUT me. I am stunned that this has happened, that God has listened to me, turned and performed on my behalf. I am praying for my ex N to be touched by Christ and healed.

We who have these experiences know that it is truly up to the N to realize the futility of his actions and heal, but there is not much hope that they ever will. I hate to say it but I am sure my N has reserve Narcissistic Supply. I can only continue building my life up brick by brick and pray that one day he will save himself, for every time his desperate actions fail, it IS God trying to intervene to show him The Way.

I hope my heart heals quickly for it is so broken, feeling the pain of this relationship and now the additional pain of knowing that my N is heartbroken (as much as this would apply to a Narcissist) and I can do nothing whatsoever to help him. I still desire my ex N physically, isn't it strange that I just want to run over there and comfort him? Heartwrenching that I know I can never fulfil his many needs. I guess that is what love is all about, though. Giving it your all (even after enduring physical abuse) until you know that they just can't love you....then you realize that we all deserve to have our love returned, and that God wants us to be happy people.

To all who are going through this, a biblical scripture, "Search and you will find, knock....and the door shall be opened." Whether or not you turn to God, search out Truth and Wisdom and you will find True Happiness. Try to see this type of relationship AS IT IS, in the light of what YOU have NOT received. Don't remain unevenly yoked to someone or something that will never fulfill you or return your love. In an N relationship, your love is returned to you in the form of anger, abuse, jealousy, worry, discontent, anxiety, suffering of the soul.

I sure have a LONG way to go, but I will have Faith and Hope, bolstered by my prayers and positive actions. It surely isn't all roses, peaches and cream. I pray EVERY time the memories of my N take over my mind - EVERY time a negative thought comes through...which is practically ALL THE TIME, EVERY PASSING DAY! More importantly, I pray to have the strength NOT to answer the phone, NOT TO GO BACK TO HIM!

And help doesn't come instantaneously either, I have to STOP, THINK HARD, LISTEN TO MY THOUGHTS, PRAY, HEAR THE TRUTH THAT HAS BEEN PUT WITHIN ME, GO THROUGH THE PAIN, to the other side of it - in order to assimilate, to be directed, to understand "why", and to finally heal, and then put the thought behind me as being solved, resolved, taken care of, done, finalized. These realizations don't include only this N relationship...it's life issues too! And I am weak, so weak. So I have to pray for strength and faith in Him and myself, for I am just a woman and a sinful human, and it isn't easy is it? I must change in order to survive.

I am gaining strength every day. Staying away from (I hesitate to use the term but it is applicable) evil, staying away from those whose hearts are deceitful, it's what God asks us to do. It takes a long time I think to realize this, because we try to help in giving our love and our strength. But only God and his power can help human beings, if He chooses to do so. Then we can only hope that the person needing help reaches out to Him to take what is being offered. It kills me to know that I am "hurting" my N when I don't reply to him. Yes, I still have hope. But I do realize the very possible - even inevitable - that my N is capable of AND WILL draw strength from yet another Supply source. I need to concentrate on MY life, live it to the fullest so I can grow in a positive, TRUE FOR ME direction. My life with my N was NOT the way I wanted to live, good times aside.

I must realize my true path in life, which has to be physical and spiritual fulfillment while I am here. It is really hard for a woman to own this concept, because we do give so much of ourselves...or try to and mess ourselves and others up! But you know, once you get started and get going, it's kinda FUN and it's RIGHT! And you get such positive feedback from your loved ones! (To think I thought I wouldn't!)

Sorry for the long, drawn-on. Again, thank you for replying and boosting my spirits. This board has helped me SO much, and thank you all. Time for a cup of tea. Keep keeping on and I will be watching, listening and talking with all of you. I pray for all of us.

Peace...mbme

AnswerHEY THERE, IT'S ME CAREBEAR, Well his girlfriend found out through a loose-lipped co-worker how badly he treated me, and he wrote me such a hateful email today, the devil himself couldn't have done better. All about how he will never speak to me again, and how I am betraying him by talking about him to friends. I truly didn't mean for anything to get to his new GF. The last thing I wanted was to invoke on of his rages upon me. I am very disappointed in my co-worker who told her friend details. Of course, the new GF believe none of it because he is in the midst of the charming full-court press. So she thinks I am a bitter ex trying to ruin her Prince Charming. But he really believes he has been victimized. It doesn't matter to him that I was betrayed by a friend, or that everything said was true, just that he was shone in a bad light. I am thinking this is a blessing because I don't think he will ever contact me again, as I have been deemed unworthy of his time. But it makes me mad that I was made out to be a vindictive ex when I really wanted nothing to do with it. This woman will figure it out in time, but no warning can save her. I wish I lived in a bigger community, so I didn't have to ever hear about or see him again. Should I just not care that he is trashing my good name to this woman and her friends? Anyone out there encountered this? How absurd that his punishment for me is that I am forever exiled from his abuse. His ego is so mammoth. Do we really believe they hate themselves? He seemed pretty happy with himself yesterday. AnswerI predicted everything truly. My ex N is SO wrapped up with this new woman that he is beginning to put her before the children. I had a horrible feeling I would hear this from the mother of his children. He is so eager to be with this woman that he sends his children home early from visitation at his home so he can go sleep with her. (Yes, pangs of jealousy, hurt, humiliation...but these are normal feelings).

By researching this disorder (the Narcissistic Personality Disorder)I have been empowered with knowledge, so I know what to expect. It didn't hurt half as much as I thought it would when I heard it. What a callous human being. What a blessing to be away from him.

Yes, it's lonely, but I would rather be lonely with hope than to be with him...mistreated and always wondering if he loves me...all the while putting up with his immature, egotistical ways. I also know that he is probably hating me, only because he cannot deal with the way he is. Hating me is easier than confronting me with truth and honor. I am so grateful that all who know him know me, and what a good person I am and just how much I loved him.

Right now I am feeling VERY vengeful, and I pray to God every night and day to exact vengeance as HE sees fit, and I know that might not take place when I want it to. I am doing poorly by not putting him in the back of my mind right now, but the sadness HAS lifted somewhat today, being replaced by disgust and a little bit of pity. Jealousy is not helpful though, because no doubt this new woman doesn't have a clue. Sooner or later he'll take her to "La-La Land". Been there, done that. Was not a happy trip.

I am thoroughly amazed at the number of people who have opened their hearts to me and helped me. I am having fun being with a new girlfriend that I met, we share our pasts (she was in a abusive relationship too) and life experiences and we go out and have fun trying to meet others...my adult kids and I go out to dinner, we go to amusement parks, they come to my house, my son and I take out our aggression playing PlayStation combat games. I don't know what I will do when my daughter moves and my son goes in the service! I have missed so much of their lives by being with the N for 2.5 years. But, I love them all the more since I realized what life is really all about. Happiness and Love.

Now life is starting to feel better...more of an adventure, I am more prone to get up and go do ANYTHING than waste time being depressed about the N. There are many ups and downs when I think of the N. I have a long way to go for recovery, but I will make it. God will put a man in my life who will love me very much. Until then, I am grateful that I got out of this relationship in one piece, financially stable although he tried to suck me dry, able to love and be loved. And I have my adult children who I love very much.

They are so relieved that he is gone. I try not to feel guilty about how much I overlooked them for him, that only depresses me and I will never be able to erase that. Best to continue to march with your head up.

I am tentative in saying I feel like I am getting a "self" , but it's tangible, the bonds are slowly being eaten away. I am still looking forward to therapy so I can really find out who I am and I need to deal with everything about this past relationship in a healthy manner. I want to enjoy my life. I hope things are going better for you, CarebearW.

Peace to all, mbme

AnswerANY communication with him will start that HORRIBLE cycle again and again. Try to understand that ANY communication with this man feeds his ego...and remember that he has NO empathy. Imagine the GALL of saying anything close to what he said! You know as well as I that what should have been said was, "I am sorry, I have a real emotional problem that I have to take care of. I know I hurt you, etc." This man does not care, he wants what he wants and people are just things to him.

He will never give you a reason why he left, but it is really because you could not give him something he lacked. This is NOT your fault These people lack self-definition. Simply. He is a shell, and nothing more. He takes what he can get from others emotionally in order to fill himself up. Adoration, adrenalin of the chase, sexual conquest, confirmation of his false greatness (ego)(?)...anything he needs to continually feed the ego.

When he tires of his main source, when they can't supply him with whatever he needs, when they figure him out, when they stand up for themselves and he thinks they don't idolize him anymore...he searches for a different victim, drug or reckless behavior or goes back to those who will give him the things he needs - just to validate his own existence and presence. They will continue this behavior because they are emotionally bereft and ill, constantly seeking to be....they simply cannot empathize or they choose not to because it would be too much emotional pain - such deep remorse would remove their god-like image of themselves. Remember, they think they are omnipotent and the rest of us are weak. Which of course, makes them PATHOLOGICAL... people to stay away from, not at all like you....right?

Well, I am sure I will have my fair share of bad news tomorrow morning about his past weekend. I really don't want to hear it. I know what is going to happen. I'll hear it, my blood pressure will plummet, my heart will beat slowly about 3 seconds, I will feel like I am going to faint with sadness and then I will pull myself together and say, "Well, what else did I expect?! Par for the course! That fits the pattern!"

I am going to forget about this psycho (ok, that is harsh, but I am SO fed up with feeling like this and feeling like a heel) and it's on to things that are right. This has all been so wrong. By the way, I reiterated my whole story to his sister-in-law. She was shocked. I am not afraid to say what happened to me. One way or the other, these type of people will suffer...what comes around goes around...you reap what you sow...vengeance is mine sayeth the Lord...I will repay.

Next weekend I should be ready for a good night out and we are GOING to have one! I have some new clothes to wear and I feel great. Life will be better than it ever was. This is a hard lesson, but we are good people and good people don't give up being good. Don't submit to depression. Don't submit to defeatism. Just by your posts I can tell you are a good intelligent woman, a hard worker, a good mother.... and YOU WILL GET BETTER and BETTER! Keep in touch. Peace and Love, mbme

AnswerMy heart breaks for you. My ex called me today because he heard through the new girlfriend that I work with her friend. He was trying to do damage control, make sure I don't ruin this new relationship for him. Of course, he threw in a couple of "you know you will always be the sweetest person I will ever know." Bull****! He just says he has to see where this goes, but somewhere down the road... What he means is if this doesn't work out, he'll come back around for me as a consolation prize. And yet, when I got off the phone, I sobbed. Because the relationship was aborted at it's peak of intimacy, and he can't give me a reason why except that he got bored with me, basically, my words, not his. No contact is the key, and I will avoid him like the plague he is. But today, I am shaking and sad, and it feels just like the day he left me, although it has been three months. I am also praying for God to take my pain away. I have children to take care of and a job to do. I guess only a devil could get in your blood like this. I will picture him that way. carebear AnswerIf I could stop your pain I would...for I am going through the same thing. Everything you just wrote I feel. I woke up this morning (and like all mornings here lately) I began praying to God to take him out of my mind.

His presence and yes, the pain is almost unbearable. We WILL learn to regard his leaving as a blessing, (excellent thinking) and I say this to myself as his ghost permeates my EVERY and I mean EVERY thought. It is almost as if I am obsessing and can't let go. I was just about to write "I hope" but when I just thought deeply I changed it to "I know" -I KNOW that I am grieving because I loved my N deeply too. Grieving takes time, we certainly are human and THAT is why it is taking so LONG!

Now I know what poets mean when they describe a broken heart, because honestly, mine physically hurts and it pains me to even take a deep breath. As I said before, I am anxious to start therapy. I am looking forward to the help. Tell me, do you often wonder if you ever will be the object of someone's affection again? Do you hope to meet someone soon to get your mind off him? Everyone says I must go through this and find out who I am and I agree. But that nagging feeling of wanting to be loved is always with me. Then I castigate myself for even thinking that way after everything I have been through, I must be wary.

I guess that is topic for conversation with my therapist. I am trying to be cautious. My family and friends have been lifesavers. No doubt I will learn of his escapades this weekend, as the children are visiting their father. His ex and I are close and she meets the other woman this weekend. So I have to deal with striking a balance with his ex so that I don't have to endure any more "mind images". His ex is a good woman but she has also been scarred, and she has to deal with him every day. She does a great job though! This new woman is talented..so I am quite sure that if she is relatively attractive she has met all his Narcissistic Supply Prerequisites.

Today I am visiting his sister-in-law and I am going to tell her about all the beatings. I must because her children visit there and she and her husband must know. I am scared and feel bad about this, but they need to know that there is much more to this story. I know in a way I am trying to lash out, but I do want his family to know what went on. Again, we are very close and they have been wonderful friends and I love THEIR children deeply. They know what he is like, but not the extent of his illness.

This experience has been all encompassing, his family WAS my family. Soon I have to call his mother because we also were very close. She is ill and I haven't called her for fear of upsetting her, but she has experienced and shared her abuse history with me, so I must get THAT over with too. (Childhood abuse pattern for my N). I hope I don't sound callous, losing this family who I loved so deeply is killing me. I want to be friends with his sister-in -law but everything reminds me of him, and that's not healthy. Another topic for therapeutic discussion!

Thanks so much for your input...I am always on this site looking for support. My heart and prayers go out to you , my fellow sufferer. We WILL get through this, we WILL be triumphant.

I tell myself as I tell you..NO CONTACT, ok? Not even a glance. That is our victory. If you have to correspond with your N, make it through a loved, trusted STRONG person, not yourself. God says, "Keep away from what is bad". And we know he is bad. Keep your spirits up and when he enters your mind, say a prayer for God to remind you of the goodness, happiness, kindness and all the traits of loving that you want to STAY in YOUR HEART forever - and I KNOW that if I ever went back to my N, I would lose my SOUL. Know that you MUST have these traits in another in order for you to fully love or even exist alone in this world.

The tortured, tempest-tossed lifestyle the N would give you, what would that be like? You would always lack trust with him, lack love, lack confirmation as a woman, feel sexually abused instead of sexually fulfilled, have constant feelings of being designed upon, when you are with him around other women you will constantly be thinking WHY you have to worry about competition - and killing yourself inside because deep down you really know that he thinks there is always someone better. What a crappy existence.

Thanks for letting me steam this afternoon! Again, my heart, prayers and thoughts are with you. Let us continue healing and begin life again, as we are supposed to live it. Happy, trusting, loving, caring, helping those around us, being happy for others, trusting that life is what we can make it with the help of God.

Now it's off the THE GAP for a new pair of jeans because I look so good. Ha! OK, that's not Narcissism, it's called boosting one's deflated ego !

Love to you all and thanks so much for sharing... Peace..mbme

AnswerWHEN WILL IT STOP HURTING? Thank you for all the support. I feel for the last writer. You wonder how the children adjust. As I type this, I know that he is with his new girlfriend, promising all the same things he promised to me. I think the challenge is to realize that he is like a used car salesman, he reads your dreams and promises them to you. It was the moments that seemed normal that kept me going. Those times when he said I made him so happy. It is just hard to accept that I loved and gave so much to someone and I meant nothing to him. I was a faceless, replaceable source of narcissist supply. He goes on and enjoys another relationship and I grieve him and cry. But it is the speed with which he continues on that affirms that he is a narcissist, and that I meant nothing. Realizing that is both a blessing and an enormous agony. I just hope I can stop thinking about him in time. It seems narcissists find a way to bind us to them that is uniquely compelling because they promise everything we ever wanted. So we face the dual heartbreak of losing our greatest dreams and feeling utterly used and discarded at the same time. God bless all of you for helping me. AnswerI was in practically the same predicament...engaged last New Years and the very same night he proposed to me in front of family and friends-he turned on me in front of them. I moved out. I continued to get reeled back in. Almost three years of his pathological lying, cheating...and I was duped the whole time! Further physical abuse, further make ups. Two weeks ago I couldn't be with him to help him through a depression, that very weekend he had another woman and now she's with him 24/7. He probably had that going on in the wings for some time, but my mind will never work like his to even fathom that type of behavior and cold, calculated planning. I love his children dearly and there was not even a space between me and this other woman for them to become comfortable with someone else, not me. His ex is also a lovely woman, who told me she endured much of the same. It has been a different woman ALOT through the years. No explanation for me, no nothing. A terrible coward. He meets so many prerequisites on Sam Vaknin's narcissism site. Truly a horrible experience, I agree. I get nauseous also when I have to hear about what he is doing. The best medicine for you is to totally ignore him. It is vindication for you regardless of whether or not it affects him. Everyone knows how sick he is, but he has no idea how pitiful everyone regards him. I start therapy too...and I am looking forward to it. I plan to let this pass as soon as my mind will let it, I absolutely will not let him affect me anymore. I am waiting on Jehovah, "Vengeance is mine", sayeth the Lord. I will not waste my love ever again. AnswerThanks again. I am seeing a therapist who is helping me. What amazes me is how fooled I was by him. As of the beginning of July, we were planning to be engaged at Christmas, looking for houses, planning our lives. Then within two weeks, he was professing undying once in a lifetime love to another woman. It is so insane, I keep thinking I am going to wake up and realize it is a bad dream. Or that he has just lost his mind. But I spoke with his exwife, a lovely woman, who reassured me that it wasn't me. He has done this with other women before. He is just a narcissist. He idealizes and devalues and then goes back to find another woman to do it again. The scary part is I don't know how aware his is of the deception, or if he really believes it. Either way, the last thing I said to him was he owed it to his kids and the women in his future to figure himself out. Narcissist or not, he must realize what he does, his lack of permanent feelings, are not normal. I just wish I could stop thinking about it. But I guess I have to process. I think you are SOOO right about no contact. I was doing so well until this unfortunate coincidence that a woman I know knows his new girlfriend. On one hand, hearing the immediacy of the relationship confirmed what he is, but it also hurt again and made me nauseous. I swear to God these men are as deceptive and sick as rapists. Do they know what they do?Hello again. I hope you are doing ok. I believe these N's know what they do but deny it. The denial is a defense mechanism that prevents their conscience from intervening. Perhaps over time and after constant denial there is no conscience left. At least this is how I have come to understand things. What comes around will go around. Someday these N's will have to face themselves.Sam Vaknin's site says that eventually there is a total breakdown in the N's defenses that either ends in spontaneous healing, or complete breakdown. In either case, it would be too late! By that time the N would have separated himself from anyone who might even care. Knowledge is power. This site really hepls me a lot.I hope it does the same for you. I will keep checking on you!

Thanks again, needing validation is true. I just found out he is seeing a woman whose friend I know. He is promising her all the same things he promised me. He has already introduced his kids to her, that makes his kids meeting seven women in eight years. And I mean meeting as in co-parenting, sleeping over, etc. I am trying not to think about him, but it is a small community. Everyone buys his lies because he is a lawyer, successful,etc. It still hurts to think I loved him so much and shared my kids and life with him, and I was so replaceable, I meant nothing. But is the painful reality I must accept to get over this. People don't matter to N's, everyone is just a mirror for them to see themselves. Thanks for the support. I REALLY appreciate it.

please stay strong!I answered your post before... I feel your pain over this. I know it's hard to believe now that you will feel better, but it will happen. I had to cut contact with mutual friends I shared with my ex. That was hard too, but I simply won't listen to how "great a guy" my ex was. I know the truth. Is it possible for you to do this, or at least avoid these people? Might help you too. You are rid of this awful man and not a moment too soon. You will heal and you will be free to find someone that really does care about you and your children. My counselor told me that we have not lost our "self". We are capable of a real relationship and our ex's aren't. Period. What you brought to the table in the relationship, the love and caring and empathy still belongs to you.We have also gained some important knowledge here. We will be wiser next time. Please don't think you meant nothing. He probably knows on some level in his warped mind that you are a good person. He is sick and flawed and his mind is distorted. He will never be able to experience the happiness that you are capable of. He likely knows this too. He can't change. he is to be pitied. You will move on. He's stuck with himself and his pentient for failure. Please let me know how you are doing! Good luck. AnswerThanks for the answer. I did what you said. I wrote down all the crappy moments when I felt lonely and cold and empty with him. How I would always feel let down after we were together because it was never as good as I thought it would be, and then, of course, his fits, temper tantrums, jealousy, selfishness, and the cold way he left me. When I remember the good things, I get out my list. It really does help. God Bless and good luck and tell me how you are doing. I am glad you are doing better!I am glad the list is working for you.Keep adding to it! I am still adding to mine after two months! Wow, I sure put up with a lot oh sh*t! I bet you have too. Doesn't make us bad girls, just a little more "tolerant" than we should have been, RIGHT? Don't beat yourself up over that, k? Now we know what ain't workin' for us, ya know? Find someone you can talk to and really let loose about how p*ssed you are. Validation for your feelings is PRICELESS! Stop thinking about him so much and think about YOU. He didn't deserve you. Period. You will find someone else that will treat you good. You will wonder what you ever saw in the creep. Give yourself time. I guess we all have to go through the necessary stages. It's ok to feel whatever you need to, anger, hurt, pity. It's all normal. Just stay strong girl! Leave him at the curb where he belongs. We know how to love. We know how to care about somebody. The N's just don't get it. Too bad for them. Let's not waste any more of our time with people that can't relate to us. We deserve BETTER!!! Let me know how you are doing. I sense that you are really reaching out, and so I am sending you all the positive energy I can. Good luck! AnswerI am making great progress in overcoming my relationship with a narcissist. I won't ever say it is easy, and I still have some issues but I am starting to feel a lot better. I hope I can say something here to help someone else. My heart goes out to those who struggle with this. With the help of a counselor I have learned to accept that my ex was not able to care. Deep down I believe that even narcissists want to be loved but are so screwed up they just won't ever get how it's done. We can't wait around for them though, because they are not ever going to change. Surround yourself with friends and activities.I had to make myself do this at first. Now I am so busy I am looking forward to time by myself. Make a vow never to take sh-t again from ANYone. Get a little mad and a lot tough. My counselor said I was tough for having put up with a narcissist in the first place. It is a strength to be so forgiving and empathetic, just don't do it for the wrong person and for the wrong reasons. I wrote down all the crap he did. Even the little stuff that annoyed me. It helps to look at the list, really it does. It helped for me to think about what kind of relationship I would really like to have.I have decided I will no longer compromise. Already my friends are noticing a difference in me. It feels good to have boundaries (I really lacked them before.)He had another girlfriend within two weeks. This hurt until I really let it sink in that he doesn't care about her either. She will find out. I wish I could warn her myself. I have made the vow to have ZERO contact. It is absolute and I won't waiver from my decision. Every day it gets easier. It's been two months now. I'd like to hear some other success stories. Maybe we can help each other. Peace! AnswerI am trying to do just this. I just was dumped by a boyfriend of 10 months. I am divorced over a year and met him four months after my divorce. I have two daughters, one with autism. This guy overwhelmed me with promises and love. After two months, he told me he wanted to spend the rest of his life with me and my special needs daughter. I came to love his two boys. Then after taking a "family" vacation with all the kids two weeks ago, he called me and said he had never loved me. Over the course of the relationship I found him to be a ridiculously jealous, ego-centric, hypochrondriac. Still there were moments of sweetness, especially as he was kind to my daughters. Interestingly enough, he preferred my autistic daughter because she worshipped him ( her dad is not good with her). Sometimes he would fly into rages over my talking to a waiter, etc, even my finding a movie star handsome, saying I didn't make him feel special. Then he would say I was abusing him. He always had to be right, considered himself smarter than everyone else. And I think tried to fake empathy, but it never seemed to have depth. He is a very responsible father but mostly courts his kids worship. He has a hard time disciplining them and talking to them personally because he wants them to see him as perfect. They are like little prototypes of him, still he is a good caregiver to them. Is he a narcissist? The way he left me was so sudden and detached. He does not wish to speak to me, and I expended so much energy trying to be so good to him. It was the promise to love my daugther that really hooked me. Do you think he knew that, or liked the idea of himself as being wonderful enough to love her? He has an enormous ego, is a fastidious dresser, and exercises constantly. I have since found out that he has a history of women he has suddenly left since his wife left him 8 years ago. I spoke to her and she said she felt he had no feelings for her, just like the "services" she provided. Still he wouldn't have left her, but was chronically unhappy with her. He told me he never fell in love with her, the same line he used with me and all the other women he has hurt. I was very vulnerable when I met him. MY Ex was emotionally abusive. Does he sound like a narcissist? Oh, yes, he also never wanted me to talk and say "I love you" during sex. Sex was great, but kind of mechanical. He would mostly keep his eyes shut and if I talked at all, he said I took him out of the moment. Kind of like he was doing it with himself. He told me in the past, he has had sexual dysfunction problems but it was because the women was untrustworthy. Anyway, when I called him on his coldness about the breakup, he said I was abusing him. He is just done with me, like a switch turned off. What do you think? AnswerYou have no idea how much strengh I have garnered from all of your shares - THANK YOU!!! You are beautiful people with huge hearts.

I wanted to share that one of the ways I have successfully gotten over my Narcissist was by entering a relationship with a normal man. We are no longer dating, but the experience enabled me to feel what it is like to be with someone who truly cares, empathizes, has compassion, is loving, knows the world does not revolve around him, listens. Having been with him after being with a N, provided the contrast I needed to really see/be reminded of how sick he was. Honestly, it has taken me A LOT of time (almost a year and a half) to come to terms with the fact that this man was/is a Narcissist. I did NOT want to admit this, and fought it at first (when a PhD Psychologist suggested it after seeing us as a couple and him individually). I 'still' don't want to believe it's true, but it's nearly impossible to deny now, especially after reading through mountains of material on the subject.

All of this to say - a key part of my recovery from him was forcing myself (because I didn't 'feel' like it) to enter into a relationship (long after we had broken up) with a normal man who provided the very things my N was completely incapable of. I was like a little sponge - taking it all in, and wondering how INSANE I was to stay as long as I did. I think we adapt so well sometimes we do not notice what is happening to us. But once we remove ourselves completely from that environ., and fill in that void with GOOD things, we begin to see THE TRUTH and that sets us FREE.

Also, I must concur with absolutely everyone who has said ZERO contact. This has been CRUCIAL for me. I formed an addiction to this man, and that has been the only cure. When I have slipped, it has always produced GREAT pain. Zero contact is impossible for those with shared children, but there could be a way to greatly minimize contact. I love the idea someone had of no eye contact when in his presence. Another said, "Don't confirm his presence"... so RIGHT, do not!

That's all for now. My hearts are with anyone recovering from a relationship with an N. Just know - they do not deserve your love, what you loved was FALSE/completely untrue and therefore never existed, and NO/MIN. contact is the only cure.

Take care everyone! God's speed...

Signed, AlwaysLearning

AnswerI have read the most not all the postings to this question. There seems to be such a deep pain that is still inexsistance with these posters. I want to answer the question with my experience hopefully it will bring hope to those who are in the desperate state of depression and hopelessness.

I myself have been there. I am 29 years old and never had expereinced depression before in my life until I was married to my N husband. Our frist breakup was in our engagement and he abandoned me of course. I hurt so very deeply I contemplated horrible thoughts. Then he contacted me and we were married within 2 weeks time my depression was relieved. But, never cured over it all because he was the temporary fix to my problem. Dealing with rejection. I did not want to be rejected and be casted aside with no concern that we were planning a life together and the he had made promises, said wonderful things and so on. In our short two year marriage he (being an attorney) filed for divorce two times in our frist year of marriage. The second one was on our wedding anniversary. I was devastated. Once again going through a depression on that hurt so bad that I could bearly breath. This last time I left him lights clicked on in my head and it became a surival instinct. I decided after hearing for so long that his life was so important and that I was causing all of the problems in his life. I adopted that same mentality. I finally told him that it was his cycle not mine. That is was his problems not mine. It was he who needed to get help. That he was messing with my life and I was not going to let anyone especially him screw my life up. I had been through hell and back with this man in only 2 years and 10 months of being with him. I gave all, I did above and beyond what would be asked of in a normal or even semi-normal relationship. KNOW THIS EVERYTIME WE HAVE GOTTEN BACK TOGETHER IT HAS BEEN ON HIM CONTACTING ME AND ME WILLING TO GO BACK. If you can handle reverse Psychological and be strong enough to do it. The best hing you can do is be happy when you talk to him if contact is necessary, be short and to the point, Be the first one to end that conservation, Be confident that you have something he needs. Becaue you do. He does not have what you need and will never give it to you. But, you do! The cards are in you hands. You always hold the trimuph card when dealing with an NPD. He was with you because you had something he is in desperate search for. (whatever it may be). KNOW Yourself and if you are confused about who you are then ask people who know you. Call on old friends, family, ex boyfriends and so on to reestablish a geniune sense of yourself including your faults. Accept yourself and improve on what you want to about yourself.

NEED IS A STRONG WORD. I learned in my marriage to quit saying I need. I read a book that change my prespective on that. You do not need to be loved, you do not need attention, or admiration, or appreciation,fanasty, excitement you do need anything but basics life sustaining things like food, water, shelter. You prefer and you have preferances to how you would like to live your life. you prefer to be treated well. But, need only says to yourself I can not live without this (man,object,house, car, trips, possessions or so on.) But, you can and your are living. I learned that is it all about choices. I have a choice in my life to be happy. I have learned that I prefer to be alone right now than be married to a monster that I feared.

o.K. so here is the power and the success story: I left my n. I had already developed that preferances mentality. I had already been proxyed by him enough that I developed his stragey of survival and abandonment. But, in a healthier way. I stated to him it was my life. I am going to end this misery. And so on. He suffered a bit through this all but, do not worry he is doing fine entact as he ever was. I have not been harsh to him I have still extended some graces and mercies but not at my own expense. YOU can have him back you hold the power to do that. In a flash you can be back in that situation. It only takes you resembling the person you were when he meet you. Confident, secure, happy, and so on. He only does not want you because he has taken that person from you. if you begin to act in those way again he will be drawn to you like a junkie wanting fix. It will be in the disguise of prince charming holding a bouquet of roses and a fist full of dreams, hopes, ideas and ect. He will promise to change things and so on. My exN this time came to me willing to give up everything he owned, his firends, his career, his addictions, and so on. Even to the extent that he told me that he would go to the doctor and get on medication. This only occurred because I gained confidence enough to say It is not ME it is you and I prefer not to live this way. I am not the crazy one and I have so much to offer to others. The cycle is abandonment and return you do not believe it when it occurs that is is a facade but, that is what it is. A facade. Ask yourself tough questions. Do you want to die because one man in your life has turned out to be a devil in disguise? Do you? You may feel that way... I know I did sereval times in the times he rejected me.. But, I have come to the conclusion that NO i do not I want to live. I do not care if his life looks fun, exciting, grandoise and so on. Mine can be boring for the rest of my 50-60 years rather than be being in volved in his life that looks great for him but for me it was torture. I can have everything he has and more. MY life can and is more fulfilling with nothing than his ever will be with everything he searches for and possess. Your circumstances right now are temporary and situational. His is permanent. You will recover and gain strength. YOu will find someone else eventually. You will go and do things. You will stop hurting. Make a choice to get help. Make a choice to disregard the errors in your thinking that holds you back. AND above all disregard EVERYTHING he has ever told you about yourself. IF Satan himself we to tell you are no good. And God were to tell you that you are more valuable than Anything on this earth. Who would you believe? The author of lies (Satan) or the author of life? Your choice! Please seek help please help yourself! please do all you can to hold on to you! You are worthy of that. You are important! You are so very important me for two reasons 1> Because I am you. 2> because you are you. I could write for hours on this. US victims of N's and other victims probably write more than all the Professionals in the field.

No here is my success. I am find a life of my own. I am exploring endless possiblities in higher education, in carrer opportunites, in trips with friends, in doing things. I am still stuck in a bitof rut but, I have kicked in the four-wheel drive and am fighting the mud and muck and getting out. It is sad that the mud and muck is in my head and I feel like I am fighting my own self but, I am not I am fighting against my head, my feelings, my negative thoughts for myself not against.

Lot of Hope to you all!!!!!! One day at a time!!!!!! YOu can be better for this all!!! Your choice. Make small choices everyday. One positive choice for yourself everyday until it becomes a habit to making positive choices for yourself for the rest of your life.

P.S. I type fast and there is no spell check button so excuse the errors. the message is what is important!

ANSWER

My success story begins with theraphy and seeking God and getting my spiritual life in order. My N, has full blown NPD. WE have been broken up about 6 weeks now, and I must say my life has been absolutely wonderful. Although, he had walked out like 20 times during out 8 mth relationship. He has called me all the horrible, names you can think of, demeaned me and told me he will destroy me. (Funny now). He tried one pitiful attempt to contact me, however reading all the posts and information on this website, I have been throughly EDUCATED on Narcissist. His attempt to contact me is to get a response, to see if I am still a Source of Supply. By the way, he has started to see someone new almost immediately, as he said meanly to me "I replaced you". and me thinks that he is getting tired of her, and she is figuring out this is a Creature, and not a human being. Funny how tables turn. In the meantime, I have lost weight from diet and exercise, have self confidence and self esteem which is growing, and am in theraphy. My success is heavily because of God in my life, giving me the strength, also I am co-dependent in tendencies and I am working through that. Glory to God, he is my rock and shield.