Pool Heating

a 462000-gallon boiler, unlikely to be found on the market :)

My pool guy was just here today and he offered the following suggestions when he fixed my teledyne heater (paraphrased): If the heater isn't getting enough water flow through it, it will stop. If you open up the heater panel on the bottom, there is a round thing on the left with a small round center. There are a few wires coming off of this. This is a safety device that senses if the lines are getting water in the heater unit. If you look at the middle of this knob looking thing there is a slot. He turned the slot (looks like a standard screwdriver slot) counter clockwise (as if to loosen it). That did the job for mine. Also, it could be some sort of clog in a line preventing the heater unit from getting adequate water flow. He warned me NOT TO open the screw thing too much, after all it IS a safety feature. If it doesn;t work don;'t loosen it too much. Also, the thing goes off when I run my Polaris filter.

Before you start adjusting something you absolutely know nothing about:

Have you cleaned the filter lately? When was the last time the filter was serviced? When was the last time the heater was serviced? That screw looking device is for one specific type of problem and in almost all cases will not apply to your specific heater problem.

k

As a general rule, darker colors will absorb more sunlight (thereby converting it to heat) than light colors. Black will, of course, absorb the most. Brown or deep blue will be close behind, but not because of what the hue is, just because those can be made in very dark versions that don't reflect much light.

To convert CFH to BTU, you need to use the formula 1 CFH which is equivalent to 1000 BTUs.

Yes there is an optimum flow rate. Kind of! The heat pump manufacturer will post on the internet or in the users guide what the maximum and mimimum flow rate through his heat pump should be. I take it that the optimum then, is anywhere within that range. My pump manufacturer prescribes 20 GPM to 70 GPM for the heat pump I will be using. Too low a flow causes the heat pump to overheat. Too high a flow is hard on system components. dburr

Solar heaters are useful for heating water with natural energy, thus saving electricity. The question is can effective solar heaters be made for less cost than using the electricity.

Stearyl Alcohol (octadecanol), isopropyl alcohol, water.

See United States Patent 6943141 for more details:

Exerpt from this patent:

".................mixing the azeotrope of isopropanol and water with up to 5% octadecanol by weight of the total solution, in order to dissolve the normally solid-phase octadecanol and thereby produce a liquid evaporation retardant solution, which, if desired can easily be rendered more storable and transportable than usual at low temperatures merely by adding n-butanol at 10% by weight of the pre-made solution."

Actually there are several methods depending on the manufacturer of the product, the primary ingredient is Isopropanol Alcohol as a carrier with some small amount of active ingredient, the active ingredient can be Octadecanol, Calcium Hydroxide or other proprietary chemicals. The idea was originally derived from a method to keep drinking water from evaporating, see this patent for more information: http://www.google.com/patents?id=M-4HAAAAEBAJ&dq=U.S.+Pat+6,303,133

These blends vary from manufacturer to manufacturer and the exact nature is often not listed or disclosed as trade secrets.

Try www.anthonysylvanpools.com

Ken

A pool is work, you have to know that going in, the purpose of the filter is to keep the water clean, the pump will make the meter spin the longer you run the filter, however the longer you run the filter the less problems you will have, if you get a rainy season, you need to recycle the water if its hot the chlorine is going to be consumed by the sun, an idle pool can be more costly than by letting the filter run constantly,if you are going to cut back on running the filter do it in the night and not during the day light hours. You will hear all kinds of answers to this questions. My personal opinion is when you open the pool up that is when the pump and filter go to work. When you shut your pool down for the season that is when you pull the plug on the filter and pump. The above is for a pool that is outside, Also the reason I say this we use to get pools also where the filters and pumps where undersized. So once a pool get out of control its harder or takes longer to get it back to its proper levels when running a pool only part time.

Yes, you can, but you will probably have to design and fabricate it yourself as I am not aware of any commercially available kits to help you accomplish this task.

What you are asking for is not unreasonable. It makes perfect sense to use the heat that is extracted from your house to heat the pool water rather than just exhaust it to the outside air.

However, only recently have the major HVAC manufacturers started thinking about their systems in an integrated fashion, i.e. figuring out ways to move heat from the places its not wanted to the places where its needed ALL WITHIN ONE SYSTEM.

At this point in time, there is no real standardization of heat pump components that would allow you to simply and easily take the heat from the heat pump and transfer it to another heat exchanger to warm the pool water because there are so many different types of heat pumps that have been manufactured over the past 20-40 years. Thus, even if someone did develop a kit of this sort, it would still require some kind of custom-built piping and control mechanism to interface with all of the different manufacturers and models of heat pumps that are out there in the world.

Hope this helps ...

from Jalex137: It's an interesting idea, but I wonder if it's practical. It seems to me that during the season that you would be cooling your house, you wouldn't need to be heating the pool.

from Uncledunc: the reason you heat the pool water in the summer is the difference in the temperature between the air and pool water. On a 75 degree day, your pool water at 67-68 degrees fees fine. But if tomorrow the afternoon temperature shoots up to 90 you turn blue and FREEZE. Living in So-Cal tells one all he needs to know about heating the pool (often with solar covers during the day, plus the heater) to enjoy swimming on hot summer (and Fall) days. Keeping the air to water temperature within about 10 degrees (max) is ideal, from my experience with 4 in-ground pools.

My father-in-law attempted the AC heats pool water trick back in the late '60's but the contraption he came up with had no controls - just a big water tank with SS piping for the Freon gas. Later he attempted to upgrade the idea with a switching mechanism to route the refrigerant to the normal condensing coils when the pool water was already hot enough. Bottom line - the hardest part is sizing the heat exchanger to the thermal load of the house (cu. ft. / not sq. ft.) and the gallonage of the pool for your typical summer ambient temperature (and nighttime temperature swings) in your local. There is no "1-size-fits-all" answer. And it takes some decent thermodynamic engineering to get it right. IMHO, the concept is feasible, but the trick is to over-size the heat exchanger and then TRY to locate a suppler of a high pressure switch to shut off the pool's heat exchanger. Otherwise you run the risk of have your pool turn into a sauna/spa... which some folks might actually prefer! But, if nothing else, in northern climates you'll get a longer swimming season without turning on the heater.

Hope this adds to the discussion. - Uncledunc

Hi :)

Costs of having an underground swimming pool built vary greatly. Where I live, in Arizona, most reputable pool builders start with a basic package of around $15,000-20,000. This is usually a basic 15,000-18,000+ gallon swimming pool with no in-floor cleaning system or other bells and whistles. However, last summer I just had one built that has three water features including a multi-tier flagstone spillway from the raised spa into the pool, as well as a tall waterfall that has a recessed seating area underneath/behind it. With all of that, the wireless/waterproof/floating remote, top of the line guts (pumps, heater, etc.), pebble sheen upgrade, waterline tile upgrade, and everything else, I paid just over $60,000. I would say that, generally speaking, you could look to have one built for around $20,000 if you didn't add too much to it.

It depends on when you want to swim. If you are looking to extend your swimming season a few months, like from May to September and/or you would like to raise your water temp 10-15 degrees than a 130K heat pump will do the job. The most important thing you can do it to use a solar cover. The heat pump will only raise the temp of the pool approximately .5 to 1 deg an hour and only if the temperature is above 50 degrees or so. So it will take 24 hours to get the pool comfortable and than with a 6-8 hour pool pump run time you should be able to have the water a comfortable 85 degrees or so. Without a solar cover the evaporation will be much higher and you will need to run the heat pump for 10+ hours a day to maintain the desired temperature. If you want to have your pool 90+ degrees regardless of the outside temp and you want it to heat up very quickly, than you definetly want a propane or gas heater. The answer is no. A heat pump requires heat to pump. NJ probably gets a little cold doesn't it? Therefore, no heat to pump. Depending on wind conditions, I would go with a Laars 400LX/LT. HM Louisiana

ANSWER: Stay with the Raypak.

according to Newton's third law of motion,"for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction".while swimming in a pool,the person who swims apply's a backward force and so,moves forward whish is nothing but an application of the above law.

No well of course it is you num-num spanner spoon dohnuty poo

It takes 1 BTU to raise 1 pound of water 1 degree fahrenheit. To answer your question, you need to know two facts: (1) there are 7.48 gallons in a cubic foot, and (2) 1 gallon of water = 8.34 pounds. So, your 16 x 24 x 4 foot pool holds 1,536 cubic feet of water, which translates into 11,489 gallons of water. Then multiply that by 8.34 pounds per gallon, to arrive at a total of 95,820 pounds of water in your pool.

If you have a 100,000 BTU pool heater (meaning it delivers 100,000 BTU per hour), then for each degree Fahrenheit increase in temperature, it will require 95,820 pounds divided by 100,000 pounds per hour, or 0.96 hours. To increase your pool ten degrees from 70F to 80F will require 9.6 hours.

Since some heat is constantly being lost due to evaporation, and the efficiency of the gas heater is never 100%, it will actually take a little more than than 9.6 hours.

INDIRECT heating and the tank should be imperious to chlorine

It matters what the average temperature is that month. Most likely, if Florida remains the same, you shouldn't need to, but it always feels better.

Generally, no, it won't be damaged. A solar pool cover is designed to withstand the sun and the weather. Leaving it out in the sun/weather on the cover roller WILL cause only the exposed section to see any wear. But serious damage will take a long time to happen. Hope this helps...

The top layer of the rolled up cover transfers heat etc through several layers deep each in turn burning the other. Covering the solar blanket reduces the damage somewhat. The "burning effect" is compounded and will eventually reach thru several layers all the way to the reel. The bubbles act like a magnifying glass. Not a good idea. k

k

Adding a solar blanket will definitely increase the amount of heat gained and held by the water each day compared to using no solar blanket at all. And remember to keep the solar blanket on at night also to keep the heat from the day in the water rather than transferring to the air. Hope this helps ... I disagree. While I have no "data" either way, my experience (and common sense) tells me: On a sunny calm (not windy) and warm day, you will gain more heat with the solar blanket off than on (since the blanket actually blocks some of the sun). On a windy, cloudy, or cold day, evaporation cooling may be greater than the sun warming effect so leaving the blanket on makes sense. Leaving it on day or night also makes sense if conserving water or chemicals is your main goal (reduced evaporation). Leaving it on at night or when the temperature of the water exceeds that of the air by some amount also makes sense. Leaving it off day and night early in the season when the water is colder than the air also makes sense (it will hold the cold in). Leaving it on too long (day or night) makes your pool green. Make any sense?

Based on your question, I will assume that there is nearly no elevation difference between the pool and the pump locations.

Given this, the only factor in the max pipe length of a horizonal run is the friction of the water on the pipes.

In this application, your pump has to do two jobs:

1) move enough water through your pool for effective filtering (in Gallons per Minute)

2) move water horizontally through the pipes

Without knowing the size of your pool it is hard to estimate the required flow rate for effective filtration, but I will assume that 40 Gal/min (GPM)is adequate (probably more than adequate, but I don't want to give you an answer that doesn't give you enough flow). The required flow rate for proper filtration depends heavily on the type and size of filter you are using.

Now, we need to know the pressure and flow rate data for your pump. I will use a Hayward 1HP Model 1580 Power Flo pump as an example:

This pump will flow 40 GPM at a head pressure of about 45 feet using 1.5" PVC pipe.

Therefore, the remaining question is how far can you run the pipe if you have 48 ft of head pressure available?

Using standard friction tables for standard diameter pipes tells me that you would lose about 6 ft of head pressure for every 100 feet of distance (for 1.5" PVC).

Therefore, the max distance that you could pump would be about 800 horizontal feet (48 divided by 6 = 8 and then 8 x 100). Remember that this is a round trip, so the pump and pool could be located about 400 feet apart.

Even at this distace, you should still have more than adequate pressure for proper filtration flow.

Just to give you an idea of the tradeoffs, if you were able to maintain proper filtration with a flow rate of 20 GPM, then you could have the pool and pump twice as far apart (800 ft).

...

Here's one that works and is free heat. My pool's next to my garage which has a corragated sheet metal roof. I got two 100' rolls of that plastic, 1" flexible underground pipe used for underground sprinklers. (note: I used two 1" pipes because my pool pump uses 1 1/4" pipe. Two 1" pipes have more water flow capability or volumn which gives me more heat transfer from the hot roof to the water.) I took the pipe and laid them both out side by side on my garage roof. I hooked them up to my pool pump after it comes out of the sand filter. The water comes out of the sand filter and goes through the sprinkler pipes on the nice hot garage roof and then back into the pool nice and warm. The sun heats the sheet metal roof up and the pool water at the same time. Oh, you might want to rig up a bypass in so you can drain the pipes for winter and such. It's a neat system and as I said... it heats the water for free! Hope that helps.

Pool heaters are needed to help keep the pool water at a comfortable temperature. A Teledyne laars series 2 model esg pool manual is usually available with the manufacture.

250,000btu